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  • Axle wrap on spring over

    In the process of swapping in full width, I am lincoln locked f&r with 38 boggers I like to mud bogg can I install one pan hard bar to top of pumpkin on rear to the frame or should I do two off each side of housing up to frame What should my pinion angle be now that it wont pivot.

  • #2
    your pinion angle will depend on what type of driveline you are using...

    if you are using a CV joint driveline, then you will want the axle yoke pointed at the x-fer output yoke (usually like 1 degree lower for slight spring wrap on acceleration)

    if you are using a non-CV joint driveline, then you will match the angle of the axle yoke to the angle of the x-fer output (use a magnetic angle finder tool to find angle.. they are cheap)

    You can set up the traction bars in many ways.. some do it off of the center housing, others have done 2 seperate bars.. it is personal choice there....

    hope it helps....


    • #3
      Most people use a Traction Bar similar to this

      We sell this particular kit, but other companies like Skyjacker make them also.


      • #4
        i like the bam bar idea,bar

        there are a couple write ups on it on jeepaholics, search and you'll find more.


        • #5
          Hey fubar and anybody else that wants to chime in got this running gear in just little problems like steering linkage I got raised steering arm but the shaft between pitman arm and steering arm seems to be to short and can I turn the pitman arm 1/4 turn or will this affect my turns from lt to rt. Can anybody out there give me some heads up on anything else I might be over looking. Thanks to all the Ideas


          • #6
            if you 'clock' your pitman arm you will loose turning radius as that affects the geometry of the ability for the arm to push or pull your steering knuckle.

            I have seen some people take a piece of DOM and actually use it to sleve and lengthen the drag link (the bar between the pitman and knuckle) and then weld the DOM, of course.

            You can also go to your local parts house with a length measurement and possibly get a longer one, like maybe out of a later wide track CJ, as I believe that those were longer bars (can't remember).


            • #7
              when i did mine i got some DOM from a local supplier, got some threaded inserts off the internet, then welded them in. i think I have about $50-$70 total in my drag link and tie rod together. you could get some DOM, cut the tie rod, then use the DOM as a coupler to space out the cut pieces. i'd drill it and plug weld it if you go that route.


              • #8
                Hey Zoediak not sure what "clock" means but must pertain to rotating pitman arm like chevys I went with a longer draglink and left the pitman arm in original position like the cj's are. what does DOM stand for also. Thanks again.


                • #9
                  blkforddiesle, by 'clock' I was referring to your statement about moving your pitman arm 1/4 turn... If I remember correctly,(brain is old), the pitman arm has a master spline in it anyway that will not allow it to be 'clocked' or moved on the box other than it's standard location.

                  as for DOM... that stands for Drawn Over Mandrel, it is a way that the steel manufacturers process the steel tubing.

                  there is also HREW (Hot Rolled Electric Welded), CDRW (Cold Drawn Electric Welded), or ERW (Electric Resistance Welded)

                  see this link below... it basically shows a difference in the drawn over mandrel or the rolled/welded

                  The DOM is going to be the stronger of the tubes (tensile strength), this is why it is used, more often than not, for roll cages and the sort.

                  *****here is a bunch of information on tubing******

                  DOM, ERW, HREW...all types of "mechanical tubing", as opposed to pipe. All mechanical tubing is dimensioned by OD and a wall thickness.

                  DOM is actually not a type of tubing, but a process that is applied to tubing after it is initially constructed. It is Drawn Over a Mandrel...which "cold works" it, giving more exact dimensions, smoother finish, and better alignment of the crystal latice structure. It is Not seamless tubing, and it started life as some sort of EW (electric welded) tubing. Most commonly, when people say "DOM" they mean 1020 mild carbon steel rolled electric welded tubing that is then drawn over a mandrel.

                  Other mechanical tubing that is not necessarily drawn over a mandrel can be either hot or cold rolled (i.e. rolled from a flat strip into a tube when either hot or cold) and most commonly available will then be electric resistance welded to form the final tube.

                  Generally...cold forming and cold working add strength and uniformity to a product, and reduce stress.


                  So VERY BASICALLY, in terms of strength you usually have, in order:

                  CREW (cold rolled electric welded)
                  HREW (Hot....)

                  Again...these are all just processes, to fully call out the material, you need to specify the type of steel...but most commonly we are talking about either 1020 mild carbon steel, or 4130 or 4140 Chromium molybdenum alloy steel or 4340 nickel chromium molybdenum alloy steel.

                  Structural tubing that offers high strength-to-weight ratio and a higher impact toughness. The steel is fully killed and melted to fine grain practice. Customers may specify yield, tensile, elongation and charpy impact values according to their needs. This product is to minimize the probability of catastrophic failure of vehicle cab structures in the event of a roll-over accident.
                  American Specifications: ASTM A500 for dimensional tolerance, squareness, straightness, twist and corner radii. Mechanical properties can vary by end user.

                  Applications: Cabs for agricultural vehicles, road and off-road construction equipment, and lift trucks.

                  Size Range: 2" - 12" (50 mm - 305 mm) sq and the standard rectangle sections of the same perimeters. Rounds available as special inquiries.

                  Typical Chemical Analysis: Alloying elements may be added to achieve mechanical property requirements.
                  C .22 max
                  P .04 max
                  Mn 1.65 max
                  S .05 max
                  Typical Mechanical Properties: Can vary to customer specification
                  Tensile strength (ksi) 70 min
                  Yield point (ksi) 50 min
                  Elongation (% in 2") 20 min
                  Charpy impact Wall Ft/lb (min) Temp (°F)
                  3/16" 11.0 -20
                  1/4" 13.0 -20
                  3/8" 18.0 -20

                  Machinability: Good

                  Weldability: Excellent

                  Testing: Generally one tensile test and one set of three impact tests are taken from each lot of tubing. Tubing is tested in accordance with the latest revision of ASTM A370. Certification of material is available.

                  Materials Resource Page Number: 41

                  1020 DOM STEEL TUBE


                  1020 is normally used in the manufacturing of small-diameter or thin-wall DOM steel tube. DOM is formed from strip and electric-resistance welded, then cold drawn to size. The cold drawing process causes the weld line to virtually disappear.
                  American Specifications: ASTM A513 Type 5

                  British Specifications: 040 A 20, 070 M 20

                  Applications: Mechanical, hydraulic cylinders, shaft, tight tolerance requirements

                  Size Range: 1/4" - 14&1/2" (6 mm - 368 mm) OD; .035" - .625" (.9 mm - 16 mm) wall

                  Typical Chemical Analysis: C .15-.25
                  Mn .30-.60
                  P .040 max
                  S .050 max

                  Typical Mechanical Properties: Tensile strength (ksi) 80
                  Yield point (ksi) 70
                  Elongation (% in 2") 15
                  Rockwell hardness RB80


                  1018 is normally used in the manufacturing of cold drawn and hot finished seamless tube. The production of seamless tube is generally made by piercing a hot rolled bar. Hot finished is generally furnished in the unannealed condition, whereas cold drawn seamless is supplied in the unannealed or S/R annealed conditions, depending on the size.
                  American Specifications: ASTM A519

                  British Specifications: 070 M 20, 080 A 15

                  Applications: Axles, shafts, gears, bearings

                  Size Range: 1/8" - 24" (3 mm - 610 mm) OD; .0218" - 3.00" (.6 mm - 76 mm) wall

                  Typical Chemical Analysis: C .15-.20
                  Mn .60-.90
                  P .040 max
                  S .050 max
                  Typical Mechanical Properties: CDS HFS
                  Tensile strength (ksi) 80 60
                  Yield point (ksi) 60 35
                  Elongation (% in 2") 15 30
                  Rockwell hardness RB88 RB60


                  1010 ELECTRIC WELD STEEL TUBE


                  1010 is normally used in the manufacturing of electric-resistance welded tube. The product is available normally in cold rolled strip (16 gauge and lighter), and hot rolled strip (.083" wall and heavier). The product can be obtained in the as-welded condition (flash-in) or in the flash-controlled condition.

                  American Specifications: ASTM A513 Type 1 and Type 2

                  British Specifications: 040 A 10, 045 A 10

                  Applications: Machinery stands, exhaust tubes, handles, hand rails, display stands, conveyor rollers

                  Size Range: 1/4" - 10" (6 mm - 254 mm) OD; .028" - .375" (.7 mm - 10 mm) wall

                  Typical Chemical Analysis: C .08-.13
                  Mn .30-.60
                  P .035 max
                  S .035 max
                  Typical Mechanical Properties: Tensile strength (ksi) 45
                  Yield point (ksi) 32
                  Elongation (% in 2") 15 min
                  Rockwell hardness RB55 min


                  1026 STEEL TUBE


                  1026 grade is normally used in the manufacturing of DOM, cold drawn seamless and hot finished seamless. This grade normally furnished over 2" OD, with walls heavier than .156". A variety of thermal treatments can be supplied, depending on the type and size of material.

                  American Specifications: ASTM A519 (SMLS), ASTM A513 Type 5 (DOM)

                  British Specifications: 070 M 26

                  Applications: Mechanical, hydraulic cylinders, shaft, tight tolerance requirements

                  Size Range: 1/8" - 24" (3 mm - 610 mm) OD; .028" - 3.00" (.7 mm - 76 mm) wall

                  Typical Chemical Analysis: C .22-.28
                  Mn .60-.90
                  P .040 max
                  S .050 max
                  Typical Mechanical Properties: CDS DOM HFS
                  Tensile strength (ksi) 87 80 70
                  Yield point (ksi) 72 70 47
                  Elongation (% in 2") 10 10 28
                  Rockwell hardness RB89 RB85 RB78


                  I hope that some of the information above helps you out....

                  but if you decide to sleeve your link with pipe, do as suggested by someone else and drill some holes in it to puddle weld the pipe to the link. This will ensure a stronger bond with the pieces.


                  • #10
                    Thanks Zoediak that was some info wow, anyways the pitman arm and steering box shaft has (4) 1/8 in teeth along with splines it is possible to clock it but I lft it in stock position gonna try it their.