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  • lockers, limited slip, posi, one wheel peel

    Just wanted some input on this topic. My rig is a daily driver. That is #1 and is not going to change for at least a year or two. I am not looking to build a competition rig or to be throwing parts at it after every weekend out. I just want to look at what makes most sense for my application.

    I had removed the front driveshaft a couple of months ago to determine if the vibration I was getting was from the front and not my rear driveshaft after doing a SOA. (It was the front). I was pleasantly surprized to get stuck on wet leaves with only one wheel peel and without 4WD at the time. Having my g/f drive an hour to deliver a driveshaft so I could get unstuck was more than inconvienient. With limited slip or a locker I am sure I would have been fine in just 2WD.

    I was thinking of a limited slip setup front and rear until I read a post the other day about a guy having his Detroit truetrack blowing up. Is a full locker more reliable and able to handle more abuse than a limited slip? What is a "lunchbox" locker? I know there are options like air and electric lockers which make the price skyrocket but I understand their benefits as well. Help with the lingo and advice are appreciated. If there are any drawbacks like chances of axle snapping increase ect fill me in. Like I said this is a daily driver.

  • #2
    Auburn ECTED
    electronically selectable locker that acts as a posi-unit when unlocked and locks up 100% when engaged

    1/2 the price of other selectables at only $589
    1800-333-5535 x 854

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    • #3
      A lunch box locker is one that can go into the stock carrier without having to take the carrier out of the housing (at least on a D35). They are automatic meaning you don't engage them manually, they operate when they sense wheel spin. Kinda like a gear limited slip. Lock Right and Powertracks are 2 choices. Others have tried the Aussie Lock which is the same basic design as the Lock Right. I think there is another by Detroit called the Easy Locker, but don't hold me to that. Lunch box lockers have quirks that some people can't live with on a daily driver. They can be tricky on turns or curves because they will lock or unlock and cause the Jeep to jerk. Once your used to it, you can avoid it as much as possible. The Powertrack is supposed to be smoother, but it is more expensive. The Lock Right runs for $250.00 or so. I have a Lock Right in mine, and while it isn't a daily driver anymore, I think it is tolerable for the money. If you have your stock rear axle, be careful about how big of a tire you put on there. Anything bigger than 31" and moderate wheeling stands a good chance of D35 destruction.

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      • #4
        Everything they said is true except I dident see any one metion the OX locker system. Basically a machanical locker thats controled by a flip of a swich. Its not air operated but cable operated. I think when I can save up the 800$ I might get one. Its the best route for my Jeep which is my wheeling machine plus my daily driver.

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        • #5
          I know they aren't cheap but the ARB is a great locker and very streetable I have had mine for a couple years and it holds up great.
          If you are using a lunchBox on a DD then having it lock on the hardball is going to stress your driveline.
          my 2 cents
          Last edited by Ratman; 01-17-2007, 02:59 PM.

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          • #6
            Just my 2 cents.

            I have the ARB on my daily driver and couldn't be happier. My next option would be a limited slip for the price factor and steetability..

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            • #7
              put a driveshaft back on

              Sorry state, a 2wd jeep. I snapped mine once and had to drive with out it for a week or 2, so I feel your pain.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by GDJeep
                A lunch box locker is one that can go into the stock carrier without having to take the carrier out of the housing (at least on a D35). They are automatic meaning you don't engage them manually, they operate when they sense wheel spin. Kinda like a gear limited slip.
                Sorry but I have to disagree...A lock-right AND a powertrax are nothing like a limited slip. They engage when the torque coming from the driveshaft is greater than the torque the wheels are feeding back through. They will both engage whenever you hit ght gas pedal not just when the tires are slipping. They actually work the same way a detroit locker works, just cheaper and they use the stock carrier.

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                • #9
                  Thanks for the input so far....

                  Now one thing no one has addressed from my original post is the strength of a locker vs limited slip. Also with the selectable lockers if it is locked when engaged is it a full open diff when disengaged or limited slip?? Does it depend on the model and the make?

                  Also I asked about the effects on the axles with lockers. Am I right in assuming that because it won't let the axle on the side with less traction spin that you are effectively feeding all of the stress into the axle? The spinning essentially removes stress from the axles in an open diff correct? This is why you see few broken axles with open diffs?

                  Sorry about all of the questions. I am trying to understand the whole scope of what happens so I can make good decisions regarding what I buy and how far I go in building this thing. No use adding a locker if that is going to cause my axles added stress and then they break which cause me to buy a heavier axle setup and yet another locker for the different axles. Make sense? I am on thin ice with the G/F about building the Jeep because her brother spent his teenage years destroying parts in Jeeps one after the other off road. (Buy one break it buy another one, his mechanical skills don't even include changing the flapper in a toilet)
                  Last edited by ex-racer#2; 01-18-2007, 12:46 PM.

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                  • #10
                    True, bad description, I was thinking more of it being there and you don't have to think about it like a limited slip. I would think a limited slip would be easier on axles especially if it was a clutch type and had some wear on it. The clutch type limited slips will eventually wear out and will not hold as much as a locker will.
                    Last edited by GDJeep; 01-18-2007, 10:03 PM.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ex-racer#2
                      Thanks for the input so far....

                      Now one thing no one has addressed from my original post is the strength of a locker vs limited slip. Also with the selectable lockers if it is locked when engaged is it a full open diff when disengaged or limited slip?? Does it depend on the model and the make?
                      A locker will be stronger than a limited slip b/c like GDJeep said the clutches will wear out in a limited slip (eventually). The Detroit Truetrac is a completely gear driven posi-traction limited slip differential=no clutches and it won't ever give you a solid lock, it will bias the torque between the two wheels. The only selectable i'm aware of that doesn't act as an open diff when disengaged is the Auburn ECTED, this is a posi-unit when disengaged and a spool when engaged.

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                      • #12
                        [QUOTE=ex-racer#2]Thanks for the input so far....

                        Also I asked about the effects on the axles with lockers. Am I right in assuming that because it won't let the axle on the side with less traction spin that you are effectively feeding all of the stress into the axle? The spinning essentially removes stress from the axles in an open diff correct? This is why you see few broken axles with open diffs?

                        QUOTE]

                        Yes, if you have a full locker (detroit/lock-right/any selectable locker when engaged) it will create a little more stress on the axleshafts. If one tire is on the ice, and one tire is on dry pavement in an open diff, 50% of the torque is fed to the wheel on the ice and it will spin (the other 50% is lost through the spider gears). However, with a locker if one wheel is on ice and the other on dry pavement, a full 100% of the torque is fed through the axleshaft of the tire on the pavement (because it isn't taking any torque to spin the one on the ice). This can cause an axle shaft to break.

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                        • #13
                          "I am trying to understand the whole scope of what happens so I can make good decisions regarding what I buy and how far I go in building this thing. No use adding a locker if that is going to cause my axles added stress and then they break which cause me to buy a heavier axle setup and yet another locker for the different axles."


                          I am Totally with you here ex- Racer. Anyone else Running the Auburn ECTED and happy with the results?

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                          • #14
                            Lockers and limited slip

                            Try this site for a discussion of all types of traction enhancers:
                            www.angelfire.com/my/fastcar/diffey.html

                            The idea that a clutch-type positraction is weak is just wrong as anyone that ever drove one of the 60's supercars would attest. They do require special lubricant and the clutches will require replacement eventually but they offer the best driveability in many situations including most street driving. They do not offer complete lockup, however, and would not be desireable for rock climbers.

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                            • #15
                              Thanks for all of the help guys. I think I have a pretty good handle on it now.

                              My plan was a basic build up and keep it streetable and go have some fun and then assess anything else I needed as I went. After my little event in getting stuck when I had the front driveshaft out I was completely bummed out. It made me realize just how little traction I had at the rear when wet leaves and clay on level ground can leave you stranded. Add to the fact that when it snows I have to put it in 4WD for the tiniest bit of snow or ice. My Civic has more traction than the Jeep has in 2WD. It just boggles my mind.

                              I guess I am a bit gun shy now to go wheeling without making a decision on a limited slip or a locker of some kind. At least I have a 9000lb winch sitting on the bench waiting to go on when I get my bumper made.

                              Cost of Jeep $1000.
                              Rad, fuel pump, hoses, water pump, thermostat, alternator, bondo and all the things to make your Jeep roadworthy in the first 2months $1000
                              SOA including all parts and fixing problems while doing SOA $1000.
                              SYE and drive shafts, including the first one before the SYE $1000.
                              All other projects you might ever want to do to your Jeep $1000ea.
                              Cost of all the roses and jewlery you need to buy G/F because of Jeep $1000

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